I'm trying to work out what oversize pistons I need for my scratch-built Domi 88 500 engine (1958). The bores in the cylinder block look good, so I want to avoid the cost of a rebore. They measure 67.50+/- 0.05 mm all round , which is also good news.
In old money, that's 2.657" which seems to be +0.050" ? Where on earth can I get +50 thou pistons, assuming that is the correct fit?
Just as a back-check, what should the cold-build radial clearance be on the 500 twins?
thanks,
Russ Payne
I make that +60 thou. 67.5 …
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If the bore does not work…
If the bore does not work with + 60 pistons i have heard that 99 or 650 pistons can be fitted after a bore.
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That's great David - I can…
That's great David - I can find a pair of +0.060" pistons I think.
I wasn't sure how cold build clearance was calculated for the twins, hence my guess that I needed +0.050's instead.
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I hope that works out. Do…
I hope that works out. Do you have a proper bore gauge? If the +60 is the result of a rebore it ought to be OK, but if it is the result of wear then all bets are off!
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No, I'm using a digital…
No, I'm using a digital Vernier, but taking several measurements around the circumference of skirt and crown and then averaging. I get consistent results, one evening to another. Good enough for this rebuild.....it's not going to the TT!
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Fitting 99 pistons
You can fit 650 std pistons to an 88 (68mm) BUT be careful if you try fitting 99 pistons as the skirts are too long and will hit the flywheel. Having said that, I think pistons supplied for 99s these days have the same skirt length as 650 pistons but still worth a check particulalry if you have found some NOS 99 pistons.
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99 Pistons
A 99 or 650 piston is 0•0197" larger than an 88 bore at + 0•060" . Why is it suggested that either of these two pistons could be used as an alternative if the correct ones are unavailable?
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Have you measured the bore,…
Have you measured the bore, or some old pistons? Pistons are both tapered and oval.
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Hi Gordon, I have not tried…
Hi Gordon, I have not tried that combination myself,and while I would think you would need to check the slot in the bottom of the barrels, I was thinking that the reduced throw of the 88 crank in comparison to the the 99 would give the clearance for the skirts , perhaps someone with bits to hand might like to solve the puzzle. I bet Phil Knows .
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Over-weight
The biggest problem that I have come across is the weight of new, replacement pistons. Any of the recommended versions are generally 50g heavier each than original Hepolites/Heplex/AE etc. This in turn may result in the need for a crankshaft rebalance or a teeth review at the next service.
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Oversize pistons for an 88 Domi
Very interesting, and explains why a pair of EBay "Model 88 +0.0.60" pistons had been machined down on the skirt - most probably a 99 set? The seller couldn't explain.
Anyway, most grateful. Seems I can source pistons from anywhere in the 500 - 650 range, whilst bearing in mind the flywheel clearance issue.
Thanks all,
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You would have to bore out…
You would have to bore out to 68 mm to use std 600/650 pistons, but at least you would be able to use decent old SH or old stock pistons . 30 years ago I bought some dusty unboxed bare +10 650 ss pistons From Russels , rings and clips from Bratby and used the light 99 gudgion pins . ( not good practise !) .Knife edged and lightened the skirts ,and its gone like a bomb ever since. Perhaps its a delayed action bomb !!. If the bore is good you may be able to use lighter old stock + 60 88 pistons ,avoiding slotted skirt type unless you are an easy rider.
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...because allegedly a worn…
...because allegedly a worn 88 can be bored out to fit 99 pistons. Does anyone know the size of the exterior of an 88 cylinder compared with a 99? Surely a 68mm bore is as far as an 88 can go?
And will there ever be new standard 88SS barrels?
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I always assumed that the…
I always assumed that the reason the 88 could be bored out to use a 99 piston is that they started off with the same amount of "meat" in them.
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It has been done
'Twas many years ago but I had an 88 at + .060 and needing a rebore so rather than sleeve it had it bored to 68mm and fitted 650 std pistons. The wall thickness was ok. In fact, I suspect the 88 and 99 castings start off the same outer wall dimensions but the 99 just gets bored out more.
It worked a treat.
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Barrel castings
The alternator 88 & 99 barrels were both machined from 22709 castings. As were the first 650 barrels. But the latter had a modified front fin arrangement.
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Which explains...
why an engine blow-up on a 99 is catastrophic as the thin barrel walls shatter when hit by a flailing con rod whereas the thicker walls on an 88 often survive.
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I make that +60 thou. 67.5 - 66 = 1.5; 1.5/25.4 = 0.059".
The bore size should be the exact overbore. I see RGM have +.060 pistons, so they should fit because they should bore to +.060" and the clearance is provided by the piston manufacturer.
What happened to your pistons if the bore is good?