We went out on a ride last week, a.j.s. , matchless, triumph, and me on the 1959 es2.
After a good ride of about 50 miles, disaster.
Typically, in the middle of nowhere the Norton started spewing oil, luckily the last rider noticed it and we pulled in.
Oil appeared to be coming from everywhere but mainly chaincase.
We took off the tank and seat but could not find anything obvious.
R.A.C. delivered me home [9 hours, yes 9 hours between first calling them and the arrival of the flatbed lorry]
Yesterday there was very little in the oil tank, one pint in sump and an excess of 1/2 pint in the primary chaincase.
Possibly the oil pump has failed and is not scavenging.
Where do I go from here? Advise please
Whats the history of the…
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I have nothing complimentary…
I have nothing complimentary to say about the RAC, I am a member, but not for much longer. I think if it was me I’d put some oil in the tank and start it up briefly to see if any oil is returning. And look at the mag chain breather and see if any oil is coming out of there - that’ll give an indication of the problem, I think I recall using an o ring instead of the fibre oil pump washer. Also look for kinked or blocked pipes? I assume this is a new problem, ie that it was working ok previously?
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Thanks for the very speedy…
Thanks for the very speedy reply
The bike has been very reliable, with the usual problems, clutch, magneto, flat tyres blown head gasket etc.
I had not used it for about 9 months [royal enfield Bullet being used]
I will take off the oil tank and check oil lines this morning and maybe delve deeper
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I've been using...
... Britannia for many years (but never had to have a Norton recovered!) I'm currently having trouble with a little Yamaha 250 and have needed recovery 3 times. Maximum wait was 1 hour, minimum 30 minutes. They use specialised bike transporters who arrive in properly kitted out vans.
I have bike cover included with my insurance but have never tried it....
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All oil pipes disconnected…
All oil pipes disconnected and clear, oil tank clean and no debris in the filter, now to take exhaust off and tackle mag drive side to get to oil pump
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Are you sure the oil pump is…
Are you sure the oil pump is at fault- is it returning oil to the tank?
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We checked the oil return…
We checked the oil return when it stopped originally and there was no oil returning to tank, with 1 pint in the sump Istill suspect problem with yhe pump, but will look tomorrow [raining tomorrow so garage time]
Is there an oil pressure valve anywhere?
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There's a pressure release valve...
... in the timing cover but that's after the feed side of the pump and if it failed then oil would bypass the mains / big end and end up in the crankcase anyway so should be returned to the tank by the pump.
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I was with the RAC , I broke…
I was with the RAC Full recovery any vehicle anywhere in europe. , I broke down a few miles south of Croydon. I was then 75 years old. I was in a vulnerable state and place . I told them clearly what was needed and they sent a couple of people in small vans to look at me.I was repeatedly told a couple of Hours . No drink ,no food no toilet facilities .After 7 or 8 hours (11pm) i got a relative to bring a van .The RAC do not possess a suitable vehicle .they would have contracted it out except they had no one to do it. I was told they were not busy!. The AA have kit that will carry bikes , RAC do not. Do not waste your money .
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3/8 or 5/8 inch
1959 ES2 TIMING BTDC
A mate came around to set up ignition timing, he set it to 3/8 of an inch, saying 5/8 was far too much, it starts and runs [on the stand] all the info seems to suggest 5/8 inch
It has a 398 amal monobloc
comments please
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E F Franks writes 5/8". And…
E F Franks (the designer) writes 5/8". And he was a far greater Norton expert than your pal.
(Of course it's easy to start and tickover at 3/8". But it will be slower and run hotter.)
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If you are running standard…
If you are running standard compression (about 7:1) you need 5/8", I used to run mine at just over 8:1 and it ran best at about 1/2" btdc.
John
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Mine was fine...
...at 5/8" and an 8.5:1 CR. The beauty of manual advance is that you can set it a little bit overadvanced and back it off a bit if it's getting agitated. Then of course readjust it to your new setting.
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Many thanks, I'll reset it…
Many thanks, I'll reset it to 5/8 this afternoon
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I have found where all that oil came from
Bur what to do next?
Oil is spraying out from the crankcase when the kickstart is pumped [spark plug removed!]
Is there an oil seal on the outside here?
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and a link if that helps
the last 20 seconds shows oil spraying onto cardboardhttps://drive.google.com/file/d/1uZpQCqxMRBkLVHZH_hTxpMGwaI9nquTQ/view?usp=sharing
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What is the hole for?
Looking up from the bottom of the engine.
is this normal? there doesn't seem any way of replacing an oil seal
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I think it was originally…
I think it was originally alternator, but somewhere in its life it became magneto and dynamo [1959 engine] oil seems to be scavenging o.k.
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Whats the history of the bike? when was it last in bits, the engine that is? Could be that the oil pump seal is missing or hasn't been fitted properly. To travel 50 or so miles before it started spewing oil sounds like the crankcase has slowly filled with oil somehow. Either way its an engine strip to some degree to find out. Has the bike been fitted with an aftermarket oil filter? It could be the the scavenge side of the oil system is blocked so filling the crankcase. A while ago I dealt with a1956 ES2 that had done the same, oil coming from what seemed like everywhere, one of the main leaks was from the timing cover, someone had fitted a new oil pump without checking the compression on the fibre pump outlet seal. The timing cover was sat proud on the oil pump and not compressing the timing case gasket, hence a big leak.